Just a little bit of a concern here.
When West End Commons starts populating,
Will NIMBY parties be a thing of the past?
I'm just afraid that when young families start moving into a gated community, that there is going to be friction with those among us who are a little more uh, freaky. I can definitely see how the parents of young children might react poorly to oh, for instance, the EBR Fight Night.
For that matter, is there anyone other than NIMBY that's too close to his hideous development, and might be pressured to be less loud or weird?
What to we do to make sure we keep the right to be loud and weird?
When West End Commons starts populating,
Will NIMBY parties be a thing of the past?
I'm just afraid that when young families start moving into a gated community, that there is going to be friction with those among us who are a little more uh, freaky. I can definitely see how the parents of young children might react poorly to oh, for instance, the EBR Fight Night.
For that matter, is there anyone other than NIMBY that's too close to his hideous development, and might be pressured to be less loud or weird?
What to we do to make sure we keep the right to be loud and weird?
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Re: West End Commons
Sat, April 9, 2005 - 4:41 PMRemember, and remind the developement that they are in an industiral area, and you have the right to work, and make noise. That project is NOT residental, it's work/live. Keep working with the city to make sure they are always reminded of that.
Also know that it's not zoned for night clubs. Nimby should be a work space, with a party or 2 per year. Any more, and yes you will have problems in the end. Don't blame the developemnet if you are forced to follow the law.
Jon -
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Re: West End Commons
Sat, April 9, 2005 - 7:49 PMMy concern really is more that West End Commons has been dishonestly marketed. Every weekend there are more young families or couples of child rearing age, coming out to survey the place. Some of them are going to be rather pissed when they discover that the area smells like a mixture of low tide and sewage at least 5 days a month. I think the developers were marketing to where the money was, for a quick sell, and not targeting people who'll be satisfied long term.
The whole project is shortsighted. Those paint colors will look like an outdated fad sometime next week. The cladding won't stand up to long term wear either. Not to mention that every credible urbanist thinker in the past three decades has decried gated comunities as idiotic. There are a few front doors on West End Commons facing Mandela Parkway, but on the whole the finished plan will be very standoffish, territorial, and fortress like.
I'm not against development, I'm against BAD development. These architects have their heads up their dogma. These developers aren't really into development in the broader sense of the word, they're into revenue, and spectacle.
I think I can legitimately blame BAD development to some degree for taking away some of the benefits of lawlessness. We live in a worked where the prevailing culture seems to want the entire world mapped, zoned, licensed, sterilized and given a bikini wax.
That's why people like me seek out industrial neighborhoods, we want a little chaos. We want to see the grass grow through the cracks in the sidewalk without being torn out by some anal retentive yuppie.
That said, they're on the march, so I guess the only way to deal with'em is to make friends. At least I'll try that first. Maybe we can reason with 'em a little. But if they start yapping about how there are things going on around here that create an environment inappropriate for their children...
Fuck that shit. Show me a parent concerned about his children's environment, and I'll show you a homeowner trying to increase the value of his equity.
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Re: West End Commons
Sat, April 9, 2005 - 8:02 PMAnd there are anarchists who have their heads up their ass!
The wave is coming. Question is: how are we going to steer this big bad behemoth, if at all? Anyone want to get on city council? Talk to Nancy Nadel? Deal with Jerry? Write letters to the Tribune? Get interviewed by the Tribune?
The bulldozer is rolling...right into your back yard. -
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Re: West End Commons
Sat, April 9, 2005 - 11:20 PMThe "wave" is what we make it.
This our town, we are all adults now, so yes we should run.
I for one am helping to write zoneing laws, and undrstand the high school politics of Oakland. More of us need to be involved before West O turns into emeryville.
Who's up for a round of golf when Mandela park way gets grass!
Jon -
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Re: West End Commons
Sun, April 10, 2005 - 1:16 PMYes there are plenty of anarchists with their heads up their ass.
I'm not one of them. While I certainly appreciate the Wild West vibe out here right now, where we can really get away with damn near anything. But I know it will change. Maybe I'll move on to more anarchic pastures. Maybe not.
I see the wave coming, and I agree that there really ought to be some way to guide it. And keeping West O from becoming Emerymall is an important goal. goal. The question is, with real estate in west oakland as such an attractive investment, what can we do to keep McDevelopment at bay, and promote actual development.
If I were god, I would create incentives for individual homebuyers and individual home builders in West Oakland. I might also place restrictive guidelines on how enclosed from the street a housing development can be, and hold back tax incentives from builders who won't comply.
Oh, and I'd also go and find out who at Opus, and David Baker Associates was making all these HIDEOUS, FADDY color choices, and I would strike them blind with a thunderbolt. I think that architects working in West Oakland and Emeryville don't think they have to work on context. They mistakenly believe that there is no context out here, and that they have a blank slate. That's really bad news.
Oh, and while I was god, I'd be creating funding or incentives from the city of Oakland to create more non-profit art/education/exhibition space out here. New York City's PS1 in Long Island City is a perfect example of how a large arts organization can take advantage of an industrial neighborhood, spur responsible development, and create a unique and versetile facility. West Oakland is perfect for this sort of thing. In fact, West Oakland seems to me to have a very similar relationship to SF compared to NYC's relationship with Long Island City. We could learn a lot from their mistakes and sucesses. -
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Re: West End Commons
Sun, April 10, 2005 - 3:18 PMCould you get some PS1 info. in here for us to ponder?
I agree with you on the color schemes....especially with the new "loft" developments that encourage yuppie gentrification....they all look like they're straight out of IKEA!
I would encourage zoning restrictions, but that, as many Oakland politicians and developers will tell you, will scare off development. As a (green) builder keenly aware of construction costs and how difficult it can be to make a profit, I'm sympathetic to the issue. Still, the gross homogonization of architecture simply for profit pisses me off...especially when I see it coming into my hood!
If it were up to me, I'd develop ecovillages using unique and organic shapes and green materials...housing communities that share renewable energy resources (1-2 big pv inverters as oppossed to separate ones for each unit), shop space, laundry space, etc. Community, sustainability, and creativity would be the core values. I know, it's a fantasy, but I need to make a plug for ecocity urban development that respects the arts and people who want to make lot's of noise!
MAX, while you're God, could you make Nancy Nadel the next mayor of Oakland? -
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Re: West End Commons
Sun, April 10, 2005 - 8:05 PMI wonder why you want Nancy.
I support her on, and off. She is such a dam hippy some times I want to choke her. She toses artist out if there too close to her house, then wants us to make things out of old cans.
I can talk to her, and that means something, Jerry just looks at you blankly like he's smoked one too many.
Nancy is the best for now, but we need to start getting younger blood on the council.
If I were god you could weld in your work/live, no you would be required!
Jon
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Re: West End Commons
Mon, April 11, 2005 - 12:05 PMYou mean I can't weld in my work live?!
About PS1:
www.ps1.org/ps1_site/index.php
The site doesn't say too much about the actual development process,
but it should give you an idea of how this stuff can go right.
NYC seems to me to be much more into this sort of project. It seems like it's actually a common thing there. I worked for an architect there who did a lot of non-profit work, and inspite of the cold, east-coast vibe of NYC, there is some intensely progressive adaptive reuse going on there.
Actually, If I really was god, I'd stay out of mayoral politics.
But I would put a museum/gallery into the concrete factory silos down on peralta. -
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Re: West End Commons
Tue, April 12, 2005 - 9:58 AM>But I would put a museum/gallery into the concrete
>factory silos down on peralta.
Woa, hold on there. That factory is the only thing keeping my block low rent and yuppie free. Long live Central Concrete and Supply Co.!!
Huzzah! Amen. Huzzah!
... Besides, if the factory goes under, I've got first dibs on it as a sniper tower. (That is, if it isn't really a cleverly concealed rocket ship.) -
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Re: West End Commons
Tue, April 12, 2005 - 3:43 PMYeah I had thought of that issue.
I figured as long as I was playing God, I'd buy the 2400 block completely and do rent=mortgage conversions for all the residents. If I was God I could keep the yuppies out.
Frankly I thing the lesson to be learned here is that we all need to be a little more communal if we want to keep out neighborhood.
It's interesting that we can so easily rent together in large groups, and yet it's not often that you see a bunch of West-Oakland artist types get there shit together, take the emotional plunge, and BUY something together. All the freaks I know who own their own place - they all seem to have gotten a lot less communal when it was time to make an expensive investment, so its mainly couples that own places.
I wonder if there's anything we can do about that. Are are enough people around out here, even though we're relatively poor. Are there enough of us that we could band together and start purchasing some of the neighborhood for ourselves, before it's too late. We might even be able to find some sort of subsidy or incentive. Steve, I'm sure that you could get a DARPA or defense department grant if you just made your robots a little deadlier. -
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Re: West End Commons
Tue, April 12, 2005 - 4:03 PMWell thanks to hard work, and a buisness I managed to buy my property with 2 others. Not easy anymore.
The SRL machines in the back keep the yuppies at bay.
You guys should join the West Oakland Commerence Ass.
Great insight into the workings of our hood.
I talked to triagle cafe today, one more month, and we'll have our own BAR! with real food.
Jon -
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Re: West End Commons
Tue, April 12, 2005 - 4:24 PMThe triangle's reopening? Cool.
When does the WOCA meet, & where?
and for that matter, who else is involved in these sorts of things?
I'm more interested in action than talk, inspite of what you might think from my long winded postings,
My biggest quesiton is: WHO'S DOIN STUFF?! -
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Re: West End Commons
Tue, April 12, 2005 - 6:33 PMWell you will find people doing stuff there, might shock you.
WOCA is rather large. Mettings happen almost daily with someone somewhere in the city.
General meetings are once a month. I never go to those.
The doing things commitee is held every thursday at 12 noon.
Tree planting, park development, zoning, economic development all have started at those meetings. Be prepared to sit in long meetings for years to see real results.
ping me off list for times
Jon -
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Re: West End Commons
Wed, April 13, 2005 - 7:49 AM
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Re: West End Commons
Wed, April 13, 2005 - 8:40 PMI'm new to the tribe as well as new to W. Oakland , Can someonetell me where the triangle cafe is ? -
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Unsu...
Re: West End Commons
Wed, April 13, 2005 - 9:04 PMIt hasn't reopened yet, but it's in a stout triangular building on mandela, a few blocks toward e'ville from west grand. -
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Re: West End Commons
Fri, April 15, 2005 - 3:37 PMEvery weekend just park your old rusty car in front of your place and start hammering. Crank up the power tools, break out the welder, throw some beer cans around and play some loud music.
When the 'families' start looking around they will think twice. =) -
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Re: West End Commons
Fri, April 15, 2005 - 6:27 PMActually, seeing as I live next to west end commons, I made sure to tell everyone who I saw coming by about how foul the area smells sometimes.
They were coming by every weekend, but I think the whole place is sold.
I had considered buying a little girl's swimsuit at Target, and wearing it as best as I could get it to fit.... and then repeatedly shrieking "I WILL EAT THE CHILDREN" while splashing in a kiddie pool.
But that seemed a little too extreme.
Besides, I haven't had a good back wax in ages, and I just wouldn't DREAM of being seen in a bathing suit without being aduquately groomed, Dahling.
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